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View Full Version : 3 Month Paramedic School!!!!!



LasVegasEMS
03-18-2007, 06:08 PM
Has anyone seen this program, http://www.medicschoice.com/ . It's a 12 week Paramedic program, what the sh*t LOL

DaSharkie
03-18-2007, 06:56 PM
Um yeah.

3 months of didactic? This hearkens back to our conversation a few weeks ago about how MD residencies are being elongated nationwide, yet we think it is OK to have 12 weeks of classroom time and 520 clinical hours?

Hardly enough personally.


And considering that it costs $26,000 to make what EMS providers make scares the hell out of me.

DrParasite
03-19-2007, 12:04 AM
and yet, I know several fire departments that have a 6 month academy training (where you come out with Firefighter II, HazMat Ops, AND a National Registry PARAMEDIC cert) and you are placed on an ALS ambulance after you graduate.

almsfan21
03-19-2007, 01:36 AM
$26,000 is a little steep for me...

LasVegasEMS
03-19-2007, 02:13 AM
and yet, I know several fire departments that have a 6 month academy training (where you come out with Firefighter II, HazMat Ops, AND a National Registry PARAMEDIC cert) and you are placed on an ALS ambulance after you graduate.

Not arguing but where? Is this without previous experience of any kind?

DrParasite
03-19-2007, 10:11 AM
I know Montgomery Co Maryland has a 26 week recruit academy. I would imagine other counties have similar length academies. and yes, that is without any previous experience.

SgtScott31
03-19-2007, 11:21 AM
Nashville FD is 20 wks I believe, but certifications obtained are FFI, EMT-IV, and Extrication. I'm sure there's Hazmat awareness level and other topics covered, but I couldn't image going 6 mos and also obtaining EMT-P.

doughesson
03-19-2007, 12:52 PM
And you know what they call the guy that graduates last from that class,too.
"Paramedic ________".
Personally,I'd like a little time to make sure I knew the material instead of cramming it all into a small time frame.We are messing with people's lives here.
I had grades in EMT school good enough to go for paramedic right after graduation but I wanted to get a little field experience before going that far.Maybe I made a bad choice,maybe not.


and yet, I know several fire departments that have a 6 month academy training (where you come out with Firefighter II, HazMat Ops, AND a National Registry PARAMEDIC cert) and you are placed on an ALS ambulance after you graduate.

einsteinareya
03-19-2007, 02:31 PM
This scares me I would prefer longer schools and degree 2 years for example for gone are the days of forcing an EMT to stay a basic for a couple of years prior to Medic class.
6 month schools and part of an academy are part of the reason Paramedic’s do not have the standing of a Fire Fighter or Nurse. We have watered down classes with folks becoming medics who don’t have the basics down first. There was a thread somewhere in here that talked about EMS being its own entity only possible if we keep our standards high.

yowzer
03-19-2007, 03:27 PM
This scares me I would prefer longer schools and degree 2 years for example for gone are the days of forcing an EMT to stay a basic for a couple of years prior to Medic class.


Depends on where you're at. In Washington, the minimum field time required before you can apply to a paramedic school ranges from 1 to 3 years. Plus a semester of A&P and sometimes some other classes and their prereqs...

There are only a handful of schools, with small class sizes (There are probably fewer than 150 new medics graduating a year in the state.) 2-year degree and 1-year cert programs are available.

DaSharkie
03-19-2007, 06:05 PM
and yet, I know several fire departments that have a 6 month academy training (where you come out with Firefighter II, HazMat Ops, AND a National Registry PARAMEDIC cert) and you are placed on an ALS ambulance after you graduate.

My fire academy was 13 weeks alone. And this is essentially the same thing, another 13 weeks of Paramedic training. Zero to hero as I like to call it.

Tell me where this is so I know not to move there.

It is sad that there are too many places becoming like this. Sad and pathetic that it is allowed to be so.

LasVegasEMS
03-19-2007, 06:38 PM
My fire academy was 13 weeks alone. And this is essentially the same thing, another 13 weeks of Paramedic training. Zero to hero as I like to call it.

Tell me where this is so I know not to move there.

It is sad that there are too many places becoming like this. Sad and pathetic that it is allowed to be so.

Agreed, our apparent "shortage" causes us to drop the standards so we can "put out" more medics; well not us dropping the standards but the local/county/and or state governments.

I can't even imagine trying to cram the amount of info I got from paramedic school into 12 weeks. I think i'd have to shoot myself in the face.

Is there anyone on here that is willing to admit attending one of these programs, not to bash on you but for purposes of questioning on retention.

gatoremt
03-19-2007, 06:50 PM
The class would be 480 classroom hours plus a minimum of 520 clinical hours. 26K for the class, that is a little high for my taste. How is someone to pay that off working EMS or Fire. It would take them forever.

MidgetStalker
03-19-2007, 09:51 PM
I would love to see the registry test scores or the pass/fail ratio's out of that grossly over priced drive through medic class. Thats not even enough time to remember half the the info that you would forget in a 1 year program...LOL. Wow! Whats next?

emtcsmith
03-19-2007, 10:27 PM
One of the points raised at JEMS this year was that we can't expect ourselves to be called professional, if as a field we don't make ourselves to be so. A college Degree is the future, when will we catch up?

LasVegasEMS
03-20-2007, 12:58 AM
One of the points raised at JEMS this year was that we can't expect ourselves to be called professional, if as a field we don't make ourselves to be so. A college Degree is the future, when will we catch up?

One word, Holler!!! haha

emsforlife69
03-20-2007, 05:45 PM
seems they are taking the tradition out of this program. Historiclly the medic program was a long gurelling process. Designed to mold and shape the mind.

As an EMT, I hated this concept. It wasan't fair..etc

As a Medic, I appreceated the time, I had, with all the reading..labs, clinicals totations, practiced senarios etc...11 months for us in NYC is just enough.

Being a paramedic requires 1 skill and 1 skill only..KNOWING WHEN NOT TO DO SOMETHING. A monkey can "push green top, followed by chest pounding and 4 more purple tops" A Paramedic, can recoginze a cardiac wheeze form a almost silent chest...etc....take the high road. go to school take ur time!

DrParasite
03-20-2007, 10:00 PM
One of the points raised at JEMS this year was that we can't expect ourselves to be called professional, if as a field we don't make ourselves to be so. A college Degree is the future, when will we catch up?got to disagree with you on that one. what is the difference between a paramedic with a 4 year degree, a paramedic with a 2 year degree, and a paramedic that got his paramedic in 12 months? the 4 year medic has a lot of debt, the 2 year medic has a decent amount of debt, and the one year medic has a little debt.

what is the difference in their skills? absolutely nothing.

if I want to be a paramedic (and only a paramedic, nothing more) then I'm going to become a medic as quick as I can, usually with just a cert program.

If I'm a firefighter, and want to become a paramedic, should I take a 2 year course or 4 year program and end up with a degree that won't help me at all in my future, or am i doing to take it in under a year?

not on topic, but nursing is the same way. BSN vs ASN vs RN. they are all nurses, and clinically there is no difference in what they can do.

IMO, there are reasons why a paramedic isn't considered on par with a firefighter or police officer. and it has NOTHING to do with how long the schooling is. age of the profession, salary range, and employment type keep EMS people apart from the other emergency services.

lexfd5
03-20-2007, 10:22 PM
and yet, I know several fire departments that have a 6 month academy training (where you come out with Firefighter II, HazMat Ops, AND a National Registry PARAMEDIC cert) and you are placed on an ALS ambulance after you graduate.

That's us now. Except ours is a little longer. The new recruits will be in class for an entire year.

LasVegasEMS
03-21-2007, 10:13 AM
got to disagree with you on that one. what is the difference between a paramedic with a 4 year degree, a paramedic with a 2 year degree, and a paramedic that got his paramedic in 12 months? the 4 year medic has a lot of debt, the 2 year medic has a decent amount of debt, and the one year medic has a little debt.

what is the difference in their skills? absolutely nothing.

if I want to be a paramedic (and only a paramedic, nothing more) then I'm going to become a medic as quick as I can, usually with just a cert program.

If I'm a firefighter, and want to become a paramedic, should I take a 2 year course or 4 year program and end up with a degree that won't help me at all in my future, or am i doing to take it in under a year?

not on topic, but nursing is the same way. BSN vs ASN vs RN. they are all nurses, and clinically there is no difference in what they can do.

IMO, there are reasons why a paramedic isn't considered on par with a firefighter or police officer. and it has NOTHING to do with how long the schooling is. age of the profession, salary range, and employment type keep EMS people apart from the other emergency services.

I agree with you in some respect. However, getting the degree doesn't make you a better medic, I agree, but it des give you a broad range of ideas and experiences that you may or may not have had access to, as is the reason for college. Also, the degree doesn't have to be in pre-hospital anything; science, liberal arts, and communication degrees are all valuable and you see an increasing amount popping up in the field.

And, it's not so much the patients we see calling for degrees, but governments and accrediting agencies across the country are calling for validation of any and all professions. Having a degree doesn't make you a better anything, but it does give you the ability to say "hey, we're not just stupid medics" and back it up.

mitllesmertz1
03-21-2007, 10:59 AM
got to disagree with you on that one. what is the difference between a paramedic with a 4 year degree, a paramedic with a 2 year degree, and a paramedic that got his paramedic in 12 months? the 4 year medic has a lot of debt, the 2 year medic has a decent amount of debt, and the one year medic has a little debt.
Your view is valid, depending on what value you place on education.
A growing number of people in our country are sadly viewing education as simply a means to make more money. They make decisions about their education based solely on the cost/benefit ratio of future earnings.
You are leaving out the value of a college education.

If 2 candidates for a job are equal in all aspects, but 1 has a college degree, I'll take the degree person every time.
The desire for more learning, and the ability to operate at a higher level of education than high school, are good indications of a person's future learning potential.
There are always exceptions, I know.

I love learning, I love being exposed to different material. College broadens one's knowledge- how could that ever be a bad thing?

When we view added learning as simply a numbers game for future earning potential, we are simply making more worker drones. We are building a society of people with no knowledge, or interest, in subjects outside of their narrow field of work.
And that's not a good sign for the future.

medicone513
03-21-2007, 07:44 PM
Depends on where you're at. In Washington, the minimum field time required before you can apply to a paramedic school ranges from 1 to 3 years. Plus a semester of A&P and sometimes some other classes and their prereqs...

There are only a handful of schools, with small class sizes (There are probably fewer than 150 new medics graduating a year in the state.) 2-year degree and 1-year cert programs are available.

I didn't have 1 to three years experience before I went to paramedic school, although I should have.

emt161
03-21-2007, 11:59 PM
got to disagree with you on that one. what is the difference between a paramedic with a 4 year degree, a paramedic with a 2 year degree, and a paramedic that got his paramedic in 12 months? the 4 year medic has a lot of debt, the 2 year medic has a decent amount of debt, and the one year medic has a little debt.

what is the difference in their skills? absolutely nothing.

if I want to be a paramedic (and only a paramedic, nothing more) then I'm going to become a medic as quick as I can, usually with just a cert program.

If I'm a firefighter, and want to become a paramedic, should I take a 2 year course or 4 year program and end up with a degree that won't help me at all in my future, or am i doing to take it in under a year?





Yeah. EMS should stay to the bare minimum educational standards, so we can continue to b!tch and whine about how nobody respects us or considers us an actual profession. The patients won't benefit by our having more education anyway, right? It's all about the patch.

preston124
03-22-2007, 12:19 PM
That must be one hell of a pace for only 3 months. Not quite enough time for someone to think on their own as a medic. Scary.

mitllesmertz1
03-22-2007, 01:34 PM
I didn't have 1 to three years experience before I went to paramedic school, although I should have.
Your post states you live in King County, and your post-name of "medicone513" would imply that you work as a paramedic for King County Medic One.
You cannot even apply to attend the UW medic program unless you meet the minimum requirements:
http://www.metrokc.gov/health/medicone/careers.htm
Testing and training for Paramedic Trainees

To be qualified to test with King County Medic One you must hold a current EMT certification and have 3 years of field experience. Field experience must be in the pre-hospital EMS setting (paid or volunteer Fire Department or Ambulance Technician or Military Medic); 12 months of the 3 years must be consecutive with a single agency. Military medic or nurse / hospital type experience is not accepted. You must have a high school diploma and a valid driver's license. Competitive candidates will possess excellent reading, math and writing skills. You should be physically fit and able to pass a job-related assessment.


Therefore I would suspect you are not employed by KCM1.

Gladser3849
03-23-2007, 02:39 AM
What really scares me is that someone could take a three month long paramedic course after taking a one or two week EMT course. (see www.TrainingDivision.com or www.unitekeducation.com) They're advertising 12 and 14 hour days! As the saying goes...The mind can only absorb what the butt can endure. As if that's not bad enough, they state that all students with get "A" ambulance ride along "OR" an emergency department experience. Makes me think of the Trunk Monkey "First Aid" commercial. Check out: http://www.trunkmonkey.com/content/view/81/51/

armymedic571
03-23-2007, 08:39 AM
Vegas,
You're right on track. A degree does not make the Medic. But it will validate our professional status to the ignorant masses in the world.

LasVegasEMS
03-23-2007, 11:49 PM
Makes me think of the Trunk Monkey "First Aid" commercial. Check out: http://www.trunkmonkey.com/content/view/81/51/

I've never seen that before but it was soo funny LOL

medicone513
03-28-2007, 10:26 PM
Your post states you live in King County, and your post-name of "medicone513" would imply that you work as a paramedic for King County Medic One.
You cannot even apply to attend the UW medic program unless you meet the minimum requirements:
http://www.metrokc.gov/health/medicone/careers.htm
Testing and training for Paramedic Trainees

To be qualified to test with King County Medic One you must hold a current EMT certification and have 3 years of field experience. Field experience must be in the pre-hospital EMS setting (paid or volunteer Fire Department or Ambulance Technician or Military Medic); 12 months of the 3 years must be consecutive with a single agency. Military medic or nurse / hospital type experience is not accepted. You must have a high school diploma and a valid driver's license. Competitive candidates will possess excellent reading, math and writing skills. You should be physically fit and able to pass a job-related assessment.


Therefore I would suspect you are not employed by KCM1.

You're right I am not employed by KCM1. But I did go to HMC and had less than a year experience as an EMT when I applied.... and I did stay at a Holiday Inn last night. All you did was quote the requirements to apply to KCM1. If you're such an expert you should know that other agencies work in King County other than KCM1 and throughout western washington that send employees to UW medic school. Is it possible that these agencies don't have to follow the entry requirements for KCM1?

"Therefore I suspect you" don't have all the information but are more then willing to call someone out.

700fireems
03-29-2007, 08:49 PM
You're right I am not employed by KCM1. But I did go to HMC and had less than a year experience as an EMT when I applied.... and I did stay at a Holiday Inn last night. All you did was quote the requirements to apply to KCM1. If you're such an expert you should know that other agencies work in King County other than KCM1 and throughout western washington that send employees to UW medic school. Is it possible that these agencies don't have to follow the entry requirements for KCM1?

"Therefore I suspect you" don't have all the information but are more then willing to call someone out.



Get used to it. Ever see the movies "Highlander", or "The One"?

mitllesmertz1
03-29-2007, 10:37 PM
If you're such an expert you should know that other agencies work in King County other than KCM1 and throughout western washington that send employees to UW medic school. Is it possible that these agencies don't have to follow the entry requirements for KCM1?
"throughout western washington" is kind of a stretch, don't ya think? The only agencies going through UW are a few fire departments in King County
(ie Seattle, Bellevue), and South King County Medic 1. So where are these other employees coming from? Outside King County? I don't think so.
Seattle Fire requires 3 (5 now?) years on an aid car prior to applying.
Bellevue Fire requires 3 years.
I have never heard of someone getting hired by a FD in King County, getting off probation (which is 1 year in all departments round here), and then applying and being accepted for the medic program.

Every medic that goes through UW is either from a Fire Dept or South County Medic One. Every one.
So, you must have been accepted while on probation with your FD?

The entry requirements to get into the UW program are the same if it's with a Fire Dept or South County Medic 1.

I guess there is a chance of an exception. I'm rather familiar with the staff, and would be surprised. Please, surprise me. I'll gladly acknowledge my error.

So, how did you manage to pull off getting accepted to UW medic school while still on probation with your Fire Dept? And where do you work now?
You can PM me if you want to keep it private.





"Therefore I suspect you" don't have all the information but are more then willing to call someone out.
Naah, I'm just thinkin that I don't know any medics in King County that didn't have at least 3 years as an EMT. And lot's of wanna be's are on the internet.

LasVegasEMS
03-29-2007, 10:55 PM
Naah, I'm just thinkin that I don't know any medics in King County that didn't have at least 3 years as an EMT. And lot's of wanna be's are on the internet.

I wanna be an astronaut, I mean I am. I love the net :)

TC33FF
03-30-2007, 12:15 AM
I have seen some classes in a semester including clinicals. M-F 8-5 except clinical time. Trouble is they teach what you need to pass the National Registry. Not the high class medic that used to come from schools. Unfortunate. Places feel they will learn on the job. Mine took 3 semesters and I thought that was fast. Chris

mitllesmertz1
03-30-2007, 11:14 AM
I wanna be an astronaut, I mean I am. I love the net :)

"I AM SPARTACUS!!!!!!!!!!!!!"

medicone513
03-30-2007, 02:45 PM
"throughout western washington" is kind of a stretch, don't ya think? The only agencies going through UW are a few fire departments in King County
(ie Seattle, Bellevue), and South King County Medic 1. So where are these other employees coming from? Outside King County? I don't think so.
Seattle Fire requires 3 (5 now?) years on an aid car prior to applying.
Bellevue Fire requires 3 years.
I have never heard of someone getting hired by a FD in King County, getting off probation (which is 1 year in all departments round here), and then applying and being accepted for the medic program.

Every medic that goes through UW is either from a Fire Dept or South County Medic One. Every one.
So, you must have been accepted while on probation with your FD?

The entry requirements to get into the UW program are the same if it's with a Fire Dept or South County Medic 1.

I guess there is a chance of an exception. I'm rather familiar with the staff, and would be surprised. Please, surprise me. I'll gladly acknowledge my error.

So, how did you manage to pull off getting accepted to UW medic school while still on probation with your Fire Dept? And where do you work now?
You can PM me if you want to keep it private.





Naah, I'm just thinkin that I don't know any medics in King County that didn't have at least 3 years as an EMT. And lot's of wanna be's are on the internet.

Alright, now I know you don't understand the system. I'm worried about you being a wanna be. Lets make sure we understand each other. I'm arguing two points here. The first is that I applied to HMC (or UW medic school) without one year experience as an EMT. Truth be told I wasn't hired on full time with a fire dept. The fire dept. I worked for at the time sponsored me with there name and I had no financial backing or a guaranteed job(luckily the Medic One foundation picked up my tuition tab). After finishing school this FD hired me FT. Currently I am working with a FD in king county that has a medic one program(not the same FD that sponsored me to school). (There are some clues in here for you since you like to come to your own assumptions about my posts...think hard). I did spend 10 months or so of my life at UW medic training. I will admit my attending HMC was more a fluke than the norm.

Point two is that other depts send FF's to UW medic school. "The only agencies going through UW are a few fire departments in King County". Western Washington might be a slight stretch but what about Everett fire, Marysville Fire, Lake Stevens Fire, Camano Island, Arlington, Lynwood, Edmonds. These are the one's that I can think of that have sent FF's to HMC.

Anyway, I tried to PM you but it states you don't want to recieve emails and I couldn't find where else to PM. Either you're a wanna be, which may be the case, or you don't know every medic in King County.

HewittC4
03-30-2007, 03:55 PM
I wanna be an astronaut, I mean I am. I love the net :)

Put the diapers away!

mitllesmertz1
03-30-2007, 04:55 PM
Alright, now I know you don't understand the system. I will admit my attending HMC was more a fluke than the norm.
No, I understand it fine, thanks. As you state, this must have been a fluke, if true. And it's the only time I've ever heard of. And I've been around comin up on 20 years.


Western Washington might be a slight stretch but what about Everett fire, Marysville Fire, Lake Stevens Fire, Camano Island, Arlington, Lynwood, Edmonds. These are the one's that I can think of that have sent FF's to HMC.
Thanks for the info. I'm well aware of who goes to the program, I just didn't want to give the entire list. As you noticed, "Western Wash" implies a vast area. The actual list covers a circle of maybe 30 miles.


Anyway, I tried to PM you but it states you don't want to recieve emails and I couldn't find where else to PM. Either you're a wanna be, which may be the case, or you don't know every medic in King County.
I turned it on now, but really, I'm losing interest quickly...
I have never stated on these forums in over 4 years (3 different names!!) where I work. A general idea, sure. It's too political out there to make a statement online that's not PC. And I make lot's of non-pc ones.

So congratulations on getting hired, glad you somehow snuck in. I hope you're doing well with your dept.